(Source). The Vatican Observatory does not own each piece of equipment, nor can it give official names or nicknames to things it does not own. In 1984, the University of Arizona and the Vatican selected Mount Graham as a site for a complex of 18 telescopes. The Vatican wanted that specific site for whatever they were into. Lucifer is not hasatan, nor is it a proper name, but an honorific title given to the King of Babel meaning morning. The coming of settlers from the East disrupted the Apache way of life forever. Re: Did the Vatican name a telescope lucifer? Heres a simpler question. Even Satan doesn't known when it will happen and so he [], [] wolves calculate that one! Benedict Moran: For more than a year, Wendsler Nosie, a former chairman of the San Carlos Apache Indian tribe, has camped out on this site in central Arizona. Father Coyne further declared that Apache beliefs were a kind of religiosity to which I cannot subscribe and which must be suppressed with all the force we can muster.. Perhaps you can enlighten us by answering one of these basic FE doctrine related questions (and if youre really astute, why not all of them!). Many of us came to accept the idea that Lucifer was hasatan long before ever reading the one verse in Isa 14:12, the only place in the Bible which mentions Lucifer. Currently the observatory remains as a working scientific research area that has been awaiting renewal for a permit since April of 2009. MGIO is a division of Steward Observatory, the research arm for the Department of Astronomy at the University of Arizona . A 1986 draft environmental impact statement developed by the Forest Service said archaeological sites were detected within the observatory area, and that the most appropriate treatment of these sites must be determined in consultation with the State Historic Preservation Officer and the Advisory Council on Historic Preservation. The Forest Service also said, Presently no known impact on Native American religious use exists.. (Source). The Vatican, which has invested in the project, challenged the sacredness of the mountain based on the lack of structures or objects. and the Proposed Otter Creek Coal Mine, Fish Lake: Environmentalism as a Common Language, Hawaiian Land in Hawaiian Hands: Restoring Kahoolawe, Miwok Artifacts Found in Larkspur, California, The Wallowa Band of Nimiipuu Return Home, Sacred Lands Project: Success After Death, Salmon as a Sacred Resource in the Klamath River, Snoqualmie Falls: Sacred Grounds Transformed by the Power of Technology, Sutter Buttes: The Middle Mountain Controvery, The Arizona Snowbowl: Flushing a Religion Down the Toilet, The Black Hills: Mount Rushmore versus Crazy Horse Memorial, The confluence of the Colorado River and the Little Colorado River: Escalade Development, The Effect of the Governmental Understanding of the Sacred on Tribal Relations, The Old Salt Woman: Zuni Salt Lake, New Mexico, Tongariro National Park, New Zealand; the Struggle to Protect Waahi Tapu, Tongariro National Park:The Implications of a Joint National Park and Sacred Site, Tsodilo Hills: The Invisible San Experience, Uluru from All Angles: The Modern Controversy of Climbing the Sacred, Valmont Butte: The Meeting of People, Valleys, Mountains, Rivers, Earth and Sky, Vatican Observatory VS San Carlos Apache Sacred Land, Ward Valley and the Sacred Desert Tortoise, Yucca Mountain and the Proposed Nuclear Waste Storage Site, Get Up From the Armchair: Applying Smiths Academic Analysis of Ritual in Conjunction with Personal Experience, A Native American Church Birthday Ceremony: Critical Analysis of Spiritual Coincidences, An Exploration of Turners Ceremonial Framework, Ceremony Reflection: Music in Sweat Lodge, Combining Academic and Personal Interpretation. Exclusif: Lminent Virement vers lsotrisme | Le journal participatif et citoyen ! The director of the Vaticans Observatory, George Coyne, wrote that efforts to protect Mount Graham consist of a kind of environmentalism and a religiosity to which I cannot subscribe and which must be suppressed with all the force that we can muster.. Even incomplete, the project interferes with Native spiritual beliefs. Back in 2010, the University of Arizona, . Tucson. Another group installed a telescope it nicknamed Lucifer. Design [ edit] The University of Arizona built an underground 25,000-volt power line, electrifying the sacred mountain to the great distress of the Apache. Posted By: Steve Allen January 14, 2016. Mount Graham is known to the San Carlos Apache as Dzil ncha si an. Protesters against Mt. Why would they then be the first to build telescopes to look into space and continue to this day? In reaction to the Director of the Vatican Observatorys claim members of the San Carlos Apache residing in the area surrounding Mount Graham stated that, the construction of the telescope constituted a profound disrespect for a cherished feature of their original homeland and a violation of traditional religious beliefs., (Telescope construction on the summit of Mount Graham, 1992. The central sacred importance of Mount Graham has been known to the Mount Graham astronomers since 1968, long before the opening of the Vatican's telescope in 1993. Tom Horn and Cris Putnam - It was approximately 11: AM (PST) as we rounded the final bend and saw just ahead the towering edifices housing the Large Binocular Telescope (LBT), an optical telescope for astronomy and currently one of the world's most advanced systems. "@ronin19217435 I did know that and did you know the Vatican fought in Federal Court against The Apache Tribe and others to get the land on Mt. This ironic conflict pits the Vatican against Apache spiritual leaders, and astronomers against biologists. In addition the director of the Vatican Observatory claimed he was unable to find any authentic Apache who believed the mountain to be sacred, and who could prove the history of the mountains sacredness in any other form than orally. Jim Loudon Observatory. If you want to learn more about the Vatican's L.U.C.I.F.E.R. Even with the claimed ownership of the land and the relocation of many Apache indians, the sacred mountain remained protected by the public park service. The spiritual value of Mount Graham to the Apache was not considered. Where does it say the sun and moon hover, or whose research are you questioning? And the story goes that Copernicus waited until on his death-bed before publishing the work that changed everything we knew about our relation to the universe, On the Revolutions of the Celestial Spheres. Youve mixed the two up, rather slanderously I might add. <p>Guess What Happens When "They're The ONLY" Game In Town? Graham possesses such a sacred character which precludes responsible and legitimate use of the land" (Swanner 2015: 157). Posted By: Steve Allen January 14, 2016. Graham, critics wonder are the 'evil ones' planning a staged end times scenario By Greg Szymanski, JD April 23, 2010 The University of Arizona, together with the Vatican and Jesuit Order, announced today it named its newest high-powered telescopic instrument 'Lucifer'. The mountain is one of several which mark the boundaries of their sacred space. "When the white people, the non-Indians, invaded, they assumed the 'moral authority' versus the 'treacherous savage Apaches,'" Riley said. Nor does the NT, in all its references, ever cite Isa 14 as the basis for the hasatans fall. If anyone believes that the Earth is flat they are stupid. Tucson. These early traditions of the Observatory reached their climax in the mid-nineteenth century with research conducted at the Roman College by the famous Jesuit, Father Angelo Secchi, the first to classify stars according to their spectra. The Vatican Observatory does not own each piece of equipment nor can it give official names or nicknames to things it does not own. They were put there to mark the times and seasons and have been successful used as such for millennia. LUCIFER Built On Sacred Indian Burial Grounds. In 1873, Mount Graham was removed from the boundaries of the San Carlos Reservation and placed in public domain. May whoever searches here night and day the far reaches of space use it joyfully with the help of God. And why is the Vatican interested and want to invest in something like this? VATT is part of the Mount Graham International Observatory situated on Mount Graham in southeast Arizona, and is operated by the Vatican Observatory, one of the oldest astronomical research institutions in the world, in partnership with The University of Arizona. Notice, the Master says I saw Satan not I saw Lucifer/Haylel etc. In southern Arizona, the proposed site of a new mine is pitting the mining company, Resolution Cooper, against the San Carlos Apache people. Daniels referred to the L.U.C.I.F.E.R. Mount Graham Red Squirrels. Earth Island Institute. The site sits ab. Trying to make it seem like everything on the Internet is fake news and the only ones you can trust are the major news stations. The church held most knowledge in books which had laboriously been handwritten by priests until then. http://abell.as.arizona.edu/%7Elbtsci/Instruments/LUCIFER/Documents/LUCIFER_UM_1.1.pdf"]http://abell.as.arizona.edu/~lbtsci/Instruments/LUCIFER/Documents/LUCIFER_UM_1.1.pdf, http://abell.as.arizona.edu/%7Elbtsci/Instruments/LUCIFER/lucifer.html"]http://abell.as.arizona.edu/~lbtsci/Instruments/LUCIFER/lucifer.html, http://thirdsecret.org/content.php?153-Benedict-XVI-build-the-throne-of-Satan. 03 Nov. 2012. The really funny thing is that you consider these to be serious answers. The controversy over the sacred land and the protection of its ecosystem continues and now questions the legal state of the already build observatory. The fact is, though hasatan did fall from Heaven, we dont know what sin caused this fall; and we have subconsciously accepted philosophies about hasatan, which dont actually reflect the Biblical account, rather, the tradition of man! Web. how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! "Since time immemorial Apache people and Puebloan people have respected that mountain," Riley said. To this Apache tribe the mountain Dzil Nchaa Si An, Big Seated Mountain, is a portal to the spirit world and home to their guardian spirits, Gaahn. L.U.C.I.F.E.R., which stands for Large Binocular Telescope Near-infrared Utility with Camera and Integral Field Unit for Extragalactic Research, is a chilled instrument attached to a telescope in Arizona. How can they shift is your question. Funding for the project was only possible with the generosity of private, philanthropic support. Funding for the project was only possible with the generosity of private, philanthropic support. Get personalized recommendations, and learn where to watch across hundreds of streaming providers. Theres no way that were going to allow this to be done," people said. Dedicated in 1993, the VATT utilizes some of the most advanced and innovative optics, electronics and mechanics available once again positioning the Vatican at the forefront of astronomy.. [] sacred sites (in the U.S.) have been used for telescopes and observatories, one of which is Mount Graham (guaranteed not the Apache name for that peak: actually it is called Dzil ncha si []. 91-1350 PHXM WPC, April 6, 1992.). "Apache Tribe Distressed by Privatization of Dacred Land." Arizona Daily Star.11 December 2014. UA continues to infringe on the religious freedom of the Apache, not just through the construction of the telescopes, but through their prevention of religious activities. Mount Graham was the free land . I always thought that was just a tad weird, [] wolves calculate that one! Could there be more to this story? That telescope should be relocated to a non-destructive and more astronomically suitable site. The Lucifer Telescope, Sacred Apache Land & the Vatican Enjoy this podcast, and so much more Podcasts are available without a subscription, 100% free. False prophets claiming 09-23-17 starts 7 year great tribulation Prophecy in the News. Father Coyne stated that to convince him that the mountain was sacred he would need to see evidence of shrines and that he would not accept Apache oral history or statements by Apache-speaking Euro-American anthropologists. L.U.C.I.F.E.R., qui veut dire Large Tlescope Binoculaire avec un Utilitaire Proche-Infrarouge, et une Camra, et une Unit Intgre de Gestion, pour la Recherche Extragalactique, est un instrument rfrigr attach un tlescope en Arizona. Of their sacred space put there to mark the boundaries of the already observatory... The coming of settlers from the East disrupted the Apache was not considered are stupid said, Presently no impact. Prophecy in the project was only possible with the help of God where does it say the sun moon. 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